various rules questions

Originally Posted by Guilly

just a couple of questions, about AQ rules 1.0 or, CMAS 10, or whatever you want to name them:

-1. I heard that in Sheffield, for penalty shots, the defender player was allowed to dive without touching the wall. However, he must contact it before the start of play. New rules (AQ 1.0) doesn't mention it, is that a mistake in the rules, or a mistake in my hearings ?

-2. more about penalty shots: I have seen at least one video were a penalty is "defended", because one of the attackers is ahead of the puck before it's touched, even without obstructing the defender. Rules say attacking players must be behind the puck at the penalty shot start of play (sound signal), but they can go any legal position after the sound signal. That mean that they can be ahead of the puck, when the other attacker takes possession of it ? (and so, the penalty shot I saw in the video was just a bad call)

- 3.Corner rule: I should check, but guess that older rules mentioned that the puck must be taken out from the corner (1m radius) to "reset" the counter. Rules now say that the player must make an attempt to move it from the corner. I still think it shouldn't be a referee criteria, but the rules say it's ???

- 4.in water Side-substitution: snorkels of substitutes MUST be visible on surface all the time ? Can they submerge (without going out of the substituion area)to have a better look of the game, like the referees usually do ?


I guess that's all for now, but it'll continue.... ;-)
Sebastián

Originally Posted by Tim M

Based on my reading of rule 17.8.4, I agree with the original poster that an attacker on a penalty shot can be ahead of the puck after the start signal is given.

Rule 17.8.2 says that the attackers are initially behind the puck, but that rule specifically deals with preparing for the penalty shot... 17.8.3 describes starting the penalty shot, and 17.8.4 describes the action afterwards.

Since 17.8.4.1 states "The attacking players may immediately submerge and move to any legal position (e.g. shall not obstruct the defender)", it does seem to mean that the attackers can advance beyond the puck - if not, why would you have to add the clause "shall not obstruct the defender"? (which in fact didn't exist in previous versions of the rule). Obviously, if you're required to be behind the puck before it is touched, there's no way you could obstruct the defender.

I do vaguely recall some discussion amongst some refs about this in both 2004 and 2006, and that the above conclusion was reached each time... any refs out there who were actually in those conversations care to comment here?

Tim

Originally Posted by Carol Rose

1. your hearing is faulty UNLESS there is alteration to rules for specific vneue: in 1998 in USOA the goals were not against the wall, so an alternation was made. In regular venue, defender must keep hand on the wall until puck it touched.

2. As I read it, attacker cannot be ahead of the puck until it is touched.

3. There are 3 parts to corner rule:
a player may take puck into the corner
b. second player may replace first and SHOULD make attempt to bring puck out (that statement cases much disucssion amongst refs)
c. third palyer may replace second and MUST bring puck out beyond 1 m mark - that re sets the sequence.

4. If snorkels must be visible on the surface, then of course they cannot submerge - I don't thinki I'm seeing the question.

Originally Posted by Carol Rose

1. your hearing is faulty UNLESS there is alteration to rules for specific vneue: in 1998 in USOA the goals were not against the wall, so an alternation was made. In regular venue, defender must keep hand on the wall until puck it touched.

Originally Posted by atapene

guilly and jols are correct, the exception was made because of the depth.

for a penalty shot, the attackers must be behind the puck before the gong sounds, and on the surface.... then they can go anywhere. when puck is touched defender can come off the wall, other attacker could be anywhere.

these goals are more often disallowed because the attackers have submerged before the gong, maybe this is what happened guilly?

Originally Posted by Guilly

4) the question was if the substitutes can submerge while they are in the substitution area, just to look at the game. It seems they can not, and so, if they do that, they will get a call, right ?
Sebastián