Subbing after a goal

At 2006 World's we allowed free-subbing after the goal so that more than 6 were in the water at one time. This makes a lot of sense as it allows a team to get set for the strike quicker and has no negative associated with it. We had been doing this at tournaments in the US since World's but at PCC's someone pointed out that it is not in the New Rules. Does anyone recall anything limiting it to just Sheffield World's?

And what other rules haven't been added in? Or better yet, what was actually added? We should collaborate ahead of time to get the rules corrected prior to showing up. Does our former Sec and now maybe the new Sec have the rule changes voted on in a document anywhere? Does the Rules Director have something that was sent to him so that he could make the proper changes?

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Just in case you weren't sure, it's official -- CMAS sucks.
Oh yeah, and now they're broke.

In the Dutch competition, subbing after a goal has been allowed last season. I would argue that you should be able to leave the water anywhere as with waterpolo but I guess walking with fins makes that a bit hard.

I posit that whenever the referee stops the game, the game is out of play, therefore you can have as many players in the water as you like. As long as there are only 6 when play starts again.

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It's not whether you win or lose - but whether I win or lose.

For me, the game is not stopped after a goal. It is more obvious during the last 2 minutes of a game : after a goal, the time is not stopped, and the 30 seconds can be spent. So, only 6 players in the game area.

ah... but with the side subbing that is kind of the point. the Scoring team has UP TO 30 seconds and at times that means swimming back from the opponents goal tray to the far side of the pool, spent from the big effort to score, subbing with a player who must sprint accross the front of his teammates and get ready on the wall prior to the buzzer sounding again. Very often this is done in less than 30 seconds. It was different when the player subbing in just had to drop down into the water and be ready.

Normally after a goal all four subs are utilized, at least 3. They know who they are going in for, and it is not a question about where they are going. As long as there are only 6 players in the water when the buzzer goes what is the problem?? It worked very well in Sheffield, we do it in our local tournaments and have been for a very long time in practice games, as the only impact to the game seems to be that it speeds things up a bit as the scoring team is fully prepared more quickly.

I don't recall where this was discussed previously, but I would still argue after goals and when the clock is stopped, but not during normal advantage puck situations already have too much confusion and players swimming about trying to figure out where the 3 meter line is and whose advantage and where the puck is and what the other team is doing. I seee that as a time it may slow things down or screw up everyone.

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[quote=Duck
. Does our former Sec and now maybe the new Sec have the rule changes voted on in a document anywhere? Does the Rules Director have something that was sent to him so that he could make the proper changes?[/QUOTE]

As far as I know, the new edition of the rules is out. The 'free subbing' at WC 2006 was just that - free subbing 2006. It was allowed/agreed due to the pool configuration just as we altered the penalty shot structure in San Jose 1998. Yes, I agree it is a good rule, and it should be proposed for the 2008 meeting, and if some ground (err water) work is done in advance, so all know rule is good, likely to be changed and well tested, then we can likely implement it then and there for the 2008 WC, but all nations involved need to be aware and prepared to use the rule - we cannot spring it on them.

Couple of months ago, I sent out a request for rule change/additions proposals - to the world. I have received none back, and I was secretary until late last week. Duck you are USOA rules director - get with it.

Carol

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Carol Rose

I'm on it for the US. Any knowledge of a list of what rules were added/changed or should we do a side-by-side comparison to see what changed?

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Just in case you weren't sure, it's official -- CMAS sucks.
Oh yeah, and now they're broke.

When I first put the side subbing proposal up for acceptance at Worlds in Canada (I think), we were already using 'all in after a goal', but because I didn't word the proposal tightly enough, when we actually started using side subbing in NZ in 2004, people started telling me (!) that "No - you can't have more than 6 in the water after a goal, because the rules don't say you can"!!! Even though that was how we'd originally evolved the rule! Needless to say, a rule change was forthcoming for Sheffield, and as far as I knew the new wording was in the last CMAS version of the rules (and thus the WAA rules)?

Carol - before Sheffield I introduced a rule to allow 10 players in pool for subbing purposes after a goal, and as I remember it was voted on as a permanent alteration to the rules (NOT just a temporary rule for Sheffield!). There is no impact on the game if this is allowed to occur, only an improvement - as many people are noting here!!!