Can a player move faster than a puck

dolan · #1 (**permalink**) IP: 132.185.240.123 06-09-07, 01:15 AM

Its quite a common concept that a passed puck will move faster than a player. Not everyone agrees ...

Quote:

Originally Posted by BentFishBoy

1) The concept of a player not being able to move faster than the puck is a fallacy. Do some training. Yes, I'm willing to prove it any time you like.

In Wellington in about 1994-5 the Wellington Regional team under the guideance of their coach Steve Stoke did some tests to see if this was true.

We placed a line of players along the length of a 25m pool, about 8 of them around a passes distance appart.
When go was called, a puck was passed along the line of players till it hit the other end.
Leaving at the same time, another player sprinted the length of the pool underwater in the same direction as the puck.

The exact details of who/where it was I do not remember. We repeated the test "a few" times (maybe 2 or 3).

The results were:

The puck did the 25m faster than the player every time
It wasn't necessarily the fastest player doing the swim, but I think they would have been in the fastest 3 out of the 10 people in the team
The players were mostly international level mens players (maybe all of them were)
There were a few really bad passes and mistakes as the puck went down the line ... and the puck still won.

I have no real evidence otherwise. But seeing as BentFishBoy is sure of himself, I'd welcome a few officially timed 25m sprints. And some officially timed 25m passing lines.

Has anyone else been a party to similar tests?

(I would throw down a gauntlet here, but maybe just a clean set of underwear for BentFishBoy would suffice)

Sven · #2 (**permalink**) IP: 84.24.137.3 06-09-07, 01:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dolan

Its quite a common concept that a passed puck will move faster than a player. Not everyone agrees ...

In Wellington in about 1994-5 the Wellington Regional team under the guideance of their coach Steve Stoke did some tests to see if this was true.

We placed a line of players along the length of a 25m pool, about 8 of them around a passes distance appart.
When go was called, a puck was passed along the line of players till it hit the other end.
Leaving at the same time, another player sprinted the length of the pool underwater in the same direction as the puck.

The exact details of who/where it was I do not remember. We repeated the test "a few" times (maybe 2 or 3).

The results were:

The puck did the 25m faster than the player every time
It wasn't necessarily the fastest player doing the swim, but I think they would have been in the fastest 3 out of the 10 people in the team
The players were mostly international level mens players (maybe all of them were)
There were a few really bad passes and mistakes as the puck went down the line ... and the puck still won.

I have no real evidence otherwise. But seeing as BentFishBoy is sure of himself, I'd welcome a few officially timed 25m sprints. And some officially timed 25m passing lines.

Has anyone else been a party to similar tests?

(I would throw down a gauntlet here, but maybe just a clean set of underwear for BentFishBoy would suffice)

We did not test it this way. We simply taped it and timed it. when a flick was done from one point. and after that a player that swim from that point. And even a swimmer that started swim before that point to already have speed.. All times the puck was much faster.

And in your test. The puck is not only faster. but even in that time you can recieve the puck, control it and pass it to the other.

Jols · #3 (**permalink**) IP: 83.82.53.137 06-09-07, 02:30 AM

Hey Rockin' Rollin' Dolan....

You didn't mention whether or not the player swimming had fins on.

I have to say, sitting here visualising I am thinking that I would be faster than the puck... simply because as a forward I position myself pretty much level with the back when he passes and aim to hit the puck still in the 'air' or at worst when it hits the ground. Adding in control etc of each player I would assume that I would be able to beat the puck to the other side, especially if, as you say, there were bad passes/mistakes.

Anyway, why argue... next weekend we can test whether I am faster than a speeding puck at the Argonauta tournament. And of course BFB. If Sven feels the need he can tape it to keep the masses well informed.

Hmm... only no wall start if we use the 25m in Breda...

Sven · #4 (**permalink**) IP: 84.24.137.3 06-09-07, 02:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jols

Hey Rockin' Rollin' Dolan....

You didn't mention whether or not the player swimming had fins on.

I have to say, sitting here visualising I am thinking that I would be faster than the puck... simply because as a forward I position myself pretty much level with the back when he passes and aim to hit the puck still in the 'air' or at worst when it hits the ground. Adding in control etc of each player I would assume that I would be able to beat the puck to the other side, especially if, as you say, there were bad passes/mistakes.

Anyway, why argue... next weekend we can test whether I am faster than a speeding puck at the Argonauta tournament. And of course BFB. If Sven feels the need he can tape it to keep the masses well informed.

Hmm... only no wall start if we use the 25m in Breda...

Not iff i feel the need.
Iff you and Dolan feel the need.

But when you try it. please call me. and then i tape it.
So the masses will be informed.
As long there is time to tape any games and benson's moves also. (wink)

dolan · #5 (**permalink**) IP: 132.185.240.123 06-09-07, 03:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jols

You didn't mention whether or not the player swimming had fins on.

Yes, they had fins. In those days they would have been Technisub Alas

Not a scientific test by any means. In fact 2 or 3 isn't even a quorum.

Duck · #6 (**permalink**) IP: 66.121.19.142 06-09-07, 04:24 AM

25M isn't the right way to test it, time a shot and pick the swimmer's fastest time to cover that distance as Sven says. But at what point do you start the measurement for the shot -- as the stick begins to move forward or when the puck leaves the stick? And at what point do you end -- the first touch on the pool bottom, when the puck comes to a stop, or at some point inbetween?

BentFishBoy · #7 (**permalink**) IP: 80.195.35.180 06-09-07, 04:29 AM

Uh-uh, when I said 'a player can move faster than the puck', I was taking player control into account, not the speed of a single pass. In fact, I was explicitly thinking of the test that Dolan refers to. Only I was sure that the player beat the puck to the wall due to puck control, turn and pass issues. Maybe I was wrong?

Naaaaah, we'll have to test it.

Duck · #8 (**permalink**) IP: 66.121.19.142 06-09-07, 05:51 AM

With players of decent skill the passing should win everytime.

southernpuck · #9 (**permalink**) IP: 203.98.22.198 06-09-07, 09:52 AM

I look forward to seeing the results, BentFishBoy vs the passing puck. Bring on the video evidence Sven.

Cheers,

atapene · #10 (**permalink**) IP: 210.54.213.48 06-09-07, 11:34 AM

i reckon puck and passes should beat the player, agreeing with duck that they'd have to have a reasonable puck control and consistent passes.

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Can a player move faster than a puck

Underwater Hockey Formation and Tactics