worlds 2008

thanks Graham

all my questions/concerns answered

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http://snorkelbattlesafari.blogspot.com/

All concerns answered???? This STILL has all been done in the cone of silence. And it is a "done deal"????? How can you not be concerned? From an email saying we'll talk about it later? Wow!! I don't question that we a break from CMAS could be good, and I am sure we don't have all the information about that, and I don't know all the reprocussions, but when I hear that it is a done deal, check with the USOA President, and find out that nothing should be done yet, I have to question accepting and following blindly into this.

In the states we vote for our elected government officials and often and unfortunately it is a vote for the lesser of two evils. Perhaps I am jaded by that, but I will not sit back and let this go without expecting and getting answers. A "done deal" by whose say? I would have let this slide by when I was 24 but not at 44 with the number of years I have been involved and with the commitment I made to the US Men's Team. We want this sport to grow and move forward, not sideways.

I will help to make the new organization better than the previous, but like a badger trapped in a corner without options I will fight while it is presented in this manner to assure that what we will become is not just another CMAS . I will not just let this go. Carl says we need Hendo. Oh how many have fallen for that line before only to find that the replacement works just as well. We are cogs on a gear, when one breaks off, we fix it and get rolling again. I don't question Hendo's passion for the game, just the methods and secrecy about them. If our Federation President was aware of this, I would react differently. But since she had no idea about the "done deal" something is wrong. Surely answers can be provided as to how this came to be a done deal, who was involved, what the plan is for moving "forward", etc. If not on a public forum like this then at least to the leaders of the federations for which the changes will have an impact. Until that happens, I would guess what has been said, rumored, implied, whatever is public and will be discussed until the official announcement.

I warn that if we just sit idly by and accept this secret movement, then we will not get what is best for the sport, we will just have different leaders calling the shots.

And for the record, to date I have heard about 40 repsonses to the name Aquachallenge and not one was in favor. This coming from people in and out of the sport. A couple people that don't play but know the sport rolled their eyes, others that I just asked what they thought when they heard the name, thought reality show or some version of eco-challenge. Clearly there is a lot of explaining to do.

So consensus is out the window unless you are looking for a consensus of what not to call it. But how about 20% liking the name rather than 20 people.

And Graham, you ask us to be patient, yet there was no time to consult the countries involved. Wow, just like CMAS you are using things to support your side. How about be patient with the name change so it is done right?

I am curious as to who else is assisting Hendo in the transition and set up of the new association? Are we able to get a list of who makes up this temporary board? Perhaps with this information we can direct our questions to a group rather than an individual. Names would be great, because it may restore some faith in peoples concerns about the democracy of it.

How do we join this association, what are our voting rights, how does/will this board communicate with its members?

As for the name - how about a tag line attached to it - Aqua Challenge : the ultimate hockey experience or something like that... personally I think the name change is the least of our concerns at the moment.

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i [heart] porridge

Duck, what is becoming apparent to me by the minute is that many people playing this sport are spending way too much time underwater…and it is beginning to effect brain function. Oxygen deprivation is distorting facts. Aqua challenge is a suggested name only!!!!….Everybody in the underwater hockey world has the opportunity to contribute something better and it will be thoughtfully considered…the name HAS to change for legal reasons. This is not a disadvantage; the title Underwater Hockey doesn’t exactly conjure up illusions of grandeur!


I have read most of what has been written on this forum and I have noticed that those who have been most critical and vocal have not put their hand up, in any capacity, in the arena that matters most. You have freely criticised, but have not offered any useful or worthwhile help. Duck, you are making heaps of noise about what you are prepared to do (quack, quack, quack!!!), don’t make noise give us facts, what are you prepared to do?…What are your suggestions?…I am fully aware that the problems with CMAS have been made public to all in the underwater hockey community, correct me if I am wrong but this is the first time I have heard any input from you!!! I’m sure your support would have been appreciated when it would have mattered most… some months earlier.

And to finish, you are right ‘Alexandra’, a good question, who does make up this temporary board? (Is it temporary? Do you want these people to leave now?) I’m sure you are aware, from your own previous attempts, that governing a sporting body is difficult business. You are loved by one group for a decision made and despised by another for the same decision. It is definitely no popularity contest and as a result lots of innuendo and gossip is freely exchanged by others with your name being dragged through the mud. Maybe we should start critically looking at information exchanged and its source! It is a position that requires a lot of responsibility, vision and organisational skills. The success of the past world championships would indicate that the current underwater hockey committee has worked hard to ensure the growth of the sport as this was reflected by the number of participants at the Worlds. The current committee members no longer play….so why do they care?? They have all deliberately and actively kept in touch with players in their own countries. They have worked hard to ensure that the best competitions are organized (I hear the worlds were great), that the game continues to grow world wide and that every-body's needs are considered (I’m sure players in Jersey are grateful). Success does not happen on its own; I think we would all agree the current state of underwater hockey in Victoria is testimony to that. It requires a lot of organisation, time and effort by a body of people prepared to do the hard work. Graham and his associates Carole, Neil, Margaret and Ulysse, despite what you think of them personally, see value in the sport, they work hard to create the best competitions and I think they believe they are making a difference to us all. I guess that becomes the hard bit – separating our personal feelings towards them and recognizing their strengths and efforts.

Are you personally prepared to do what they do? I know I’m not..I have a life! We can’t even get a head for Hockey in Australia because nobody wants to do the work involved and that is a far smaller stage then the world stage. Be honest with yourself…because you could put your hand up if you want it….but think wisely…if you are not prepared to commit yourself, don’t criticize what they do, offer suggestions, offer support, become actively involved or offer any help that you think may be needed. Work with them, not against them and then you truly may make a positive difference to the sport you all say you care most for.

So which is it? A suggestion or a done deal? If this is a suggestion that will be used temporarily in 2008 and an official name change to *maybe* something different AT that tournament or if it could change prior to that tournament, there is nothing i've read from Graham that suggests this. A lot of people who have been most vocal in this particular thread read Graham's words "done deal" So is it not a done deal?? might have saved a lot of *****in to hear that a bit ago.

Secondly, I know Duck hasn't done much for Oz hockey, but he's done quite a bit for the US, and has put in the time he can for INTERNATIONAL hockey as well, maybe you don't see him writing a nice post here that says "Wow WTD you could use my help what can I do" but you also don't see the effort and time he does apply to the sport.

Passionate people may ***** some, it is obvious you've got some passion here as well, that is all good, but when people ***** its usually for a reason.

Stop_*****in',

This board does not support user names such as the one you have unortunately choosen.

You must identify yourself to me immediately via P.M. or I will you ban and your I.P. address.

If you can be a useful member of this community and contribute in a positive way you are welcome.

BUT, you can't have that user name. I'll give you 24 hours.

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Slayer of Trolls amongst other things.
Made for the Love of a Good Woman, and not a bad little player too ;-)
Chumba Concept Salon
Professional Hair Stylist

Carl, is it OK then to change my name to Fed Up??? I thought this was an open forum and you seem happy to have people openly criticize others...but a name offends you??? Is there an agenda I am missing here? I must admit I am surprised and disappointed that you feel the need to ban me because all I have done is highlighted problems that I have noted. I apologise if I have offended anybody in the process because that was not my intention i am just fed up with everybody turning on each other and as a result the real issue is forgotten!!

You all seem to be missing the point...you are almost there Tuck and I am grateful for your your insight. Now is a time to work together, not pull apart. You are right that the issue needs to be discussed from all angles...but all I have read on this forum seems to come from a negative point of view. Lets start tackling it from a positive. How can we make this better? We cannot change what has happened so now lets look to the future and change what can be. I know that Duck works hard behind the scenes in the USA just as others work hard on the world level...we can use somebody with his passion to work towards a new and improved Aqua Challenge...Underwater Hockey or whatever it was that Liam called it! I do not mean to offend you Duck I only wish to know what ideas you have. I encourage any creative individual with any ideas for a name to come forward and start suggesting...I'm sure there are many of you out there with wonderful ideas...so make them public and start the discussions flowing.

So this is probably my last entry because the powers that be feel the need to shut me down. Keep in mind Hockey and what will be best for you all. Don't tell us what you can't do focus on what can be done. Put pressure on your own federations to express how you feel...what you think...this is your moment, work together and make it a success.

Carl, is it OK then to change my name to Fed Up??? I thought this was an open forum and you seem happy to have people openly criticize others...but a name offends you??? Is there an agenda I am missing here? I must admit I am surprised and disappointed that you feel the need to ban me because all I have done is highlighted problems that I have noted. I apologise if I have offended anybody in the process because that was not my intention i am just fed up with everybody turning on each other and as a result the real issue is forgotten!!

You all seem to be missing the point...you are almost there Tuck and I am grateful for your your insight. Now is a time to work together, not pull apart. You are right that the issue needs to be discussed from all angles...but all I have read on this forum seems to come from a negative point of view. Lets start tackling it from a positive. How can we make this better? We cannot change what has happened so now lets look to the future and change what can be. I know that Duck works hard behind the scenes in the USA just as others work hard on the world level...we can use somebody with his passion to work towards a new and improved Aqua Challenge...Underwater Hockey or whatever it was that Liam called it! I do not mean to offend you Duck I only wish to know what ideas you have. I encourage any creative individual with any ideas for a name to come forward and start suggesting...I'm sure there are many of you out there with wonderful ideas...so make them public and start the discussions flowing.

So this is probably my last entry because the powers that be feel the need to shut me down. Keep in mind Hockey and what will be best for you all. Don't tell us what you can't do focus on what can be done. Put pressure on your own federations to express how you feel...what you think...this is your moment, work together and make it a success.

hey mr *****in,

i have to comment on your posts, and i was going to reply earlier but bit my toungue.

i'd just like to point out that easily the most negative items on these forums are your recent posts. there's no need for it. you urge people to come forward with ideas, and thats what these boards are all about.

i've already mentioned the fact that demanding people put their hands up to volunteer to help is preaching to the choir in here and that most people in these forums already contribute largely to hockey in their respective areas.

i like the fact that you obviously have good intentions, and i hope you continute contributing... carl isn't shutting you down, he was pretty clear that he'd just prefer you use another name.

i would also suggest that you tag your own name to your opinions, ESPECIALLY if you are going to use other peoples names and ESPECIALLY if you are throwing criticism at individuals. you'll get a lot more credibility standing beside your views rather than teeing off at people from behind an anonymous profile. ESPECIALLY when one of your main gripes is people criticising individuals.

liam